Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

Catboy said:

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

people complain allot about 9/11, and I mean,, ya, it was a Big tragedy, it was sad, but do you know what was done in Iraq ? to you know How many people died that had nothing at all To do with 9/11 ? do you know that this "war" was just for OIL, not even for what happened in 9/11 ? Do you know that every day there's More Evidence of Bush being behind 9/11 ?,,, well,,, not really Bush,,,, his just a puppet,,, but the people who tell him what to do/ and what to say,,, Did you watch "Fahrenheit 9/11" yet ?. and even that movie was hiding allot of other facts, Alex Jones also gave more facts that Michael Moore missed out. I'm for Peace, I don't believe in Bombs and Terrorist acts, but I also don't believe in Wars for money, and in Pollution, and in what Bush is doing, and I honestly don't know why people keep voting him back, but I guess the other guy wasn't any "Hero" neither. What I'm saying is that, these movies are good because its making people Finally see Color, and not only Black & White / Good & Bad. See The Bigger Picture ! Try to understand what the Reasons for blowing a building up would be,,, even if its not a good enough reason, but atleast try to see why someone would wanna do something like that,, without it just being because his "bad" and you're "good",,,, because,,, Americans can become Terrorists too ,,, not only Immigrants, you know ?

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

Contrapasso said:

Catboy said:

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.

people complain allot about 9/11, and I mean,, ya, it was a Big tragedy, it was sad, but do you know what was done in Iraq ? to you know How many people died that had nothing at all To do with 9/11 ? do you know that this "war" was just for OIL, not even for what happened in 9/11 ? Do you know that every day there's More Evidence of Bush being behind 9/11 ?,,, well,,, not really Bush,,,, his just a puppet,,, but the people who tell him what to do/ and what to say,,, Did you watch "Fahrenheit 9/11" yet ?. and even that movie was hiding allot of other facts, Alex Jones also gave more facts that Michael Moore missed out. I'm for Peace, I don't believe in Bombs and Terrorist acts, but I also don't believe in Wars for money, and in Pollution, and in what Bush is doing, and I honestly don't know why people keep voting him back, but I guess the other guy wasn't any "Hero" neither. What I'm saying is that, these movies are good because its making people Finally see Color, and not only Black & White / Good & Bad. See The Bigger Picture ! Try to understand what the Reasons for blowing a building up would be,,, even if its not a good enough reason, but atleast try to see why someone would wanna do something like that,, without it just being because his "bad" and you're "good",,,, because,,, Americans can become Terrorists too ,,, not only Immigrants, you know ?

The first thing I want to say is thatI never meant to sound harsh, and that's my bad for seeming that way. All I wanted to do was to ask a logical questions based upon the statements that were made.

When it comes down to it, my first point was about supporting "terrorists" in movies, and how those beliefs affect real life. Obviously, events in movies do not often happen in reality (maybe with the "Heat" bank robbery years ago, and some others). Even though events don't often permeate into real life, ideas, ideals, ways, and means often do. Case in point, "sticking it to the man." The terroist V "sticks it to the man" in London, Timothy McVeigh "sticks it to the man" in Oklahoma City, and Al Qeada "sticks it to the man" in New York City. All three of these groups, whether they are real or fictional have common ground and similar view-points in ideas, ideals, ways, and means.

The point: you can't have it both ways. You logically cannot support a fictional terrorist while condemning real terrorists, both parties of which have the same ideas, ideals, ways, and means of "sticking it to the man" - or in this case, hatred of government, killing innocents and destroying property.

People often want their cake and eat it to. Another case in point is saying that Bush invaded Iraq simply for oil. A lot of people believe this and are very angry. However, if this is what they believe, is it not hypocritical for these people to continue to go to the local gas station to fill up on the substance that Bush went to war over? Even further, would it not also be hypocritical to line the pockets of the oil companies when paying $2.50 a gallon to give those companies record-breaking profits in 2005? Again, you can't have it both ways. If people really believe Bush went to war for oil, then they need to stop giving the oil companies money. Otherwise, your actually supporting Bush.

The Iraq war is touchy topic. I don't agree with the Administration's excuse of WMD's to invade. However, I will say kicking Saddam out of power and finding 600 mass graves of the thousands of people he killed is a noble effort. I'll say that finding out that France, Russia, and Germany were getting kickbacks from the Oil-for-Food program has exposed the reasons why there was not a "coalition" like the first Gulf War (the world now knows that these three countries were all in bed with Saddam). I'll also say that it's interesting to note that more documents coming out of Iraq shows that Saddam had meetings with bin Laden's people and perhaps bin Laden himself. And even further, the US military was able to shut down an Al Qeada training camp in Northern Iraq. All of this is true and can be researched through boortz.com or google.

And the last point, it was recommended that I see Farrinhiet 911. Micheal Moore has been proven to be a liar through his editing of news footage throughout all of that movie. I say movie, because if it was a documentary, he would show both sides of the issue...which I've heard he doesn't do. He's such a left wing hack, he's doesn't have credibility anymore. A single example. I've heard in the movie that it says Bush is the one who sends bin Laden's family - here in the US - on a plane to get them out when all flights were grounded. It's been proven, from actual statements, that it was Richard Clarke - the terror Czar for Bush 41, Clinton, and for part of Bush 42. To add to that, both F-911 and Clarke's book - one that bashes the President - came out at the exact same time. Interesting...

Contrapasso said:

This has been a great thread, and I'm glad to be a part of this website.

In an earlier post, there was a comment about the media, and the fact that it cannot be relied upon, cannot be trusted, and if one can't see events in person, there may be no truth to it. To some extent, there is truth in that. As a regular American, I have to sit here and rely on the ethics of journalists and news companies to accuratly report the stories. CNN, MSNBC, the New York Times, the LA Times are seen as left-leaning, and may report their stories from the liberal point of view. Same with Fox News Channel and the Wall Street journal because they're seen as right-leaning. However, there are cases and stories that all media companies report on.

One such event was a story, with pictures and video, of a mass grave of 500 to 1000 victims unearthed in Iraq. It showed people with shovels hitting skulls and bones, and a machine digging through the ground. It also showed scores of women in a huge, open room looking over tattered and ruined clothes in hopes of identifying family members. This story was covered by all the news organization about two years ago.

Now, the first quesions one may ask is, did that really happen in Iraq? Did you see it with your own eyes? Couldn't it have been set up in the fashion of Wag the Dog? Again, all legitimate questions if that's the way you filter out all the information presented to you. But, it's also up to the individual to agree, disagree, or invalidate a news story. As much as CNN and MSNBC would hate to give President Bush any kind of credit for doing something good in Iraq, they - along with Fox News - covered the story.

This is just one example that Saddam Hussien had no care or regard for the Muslims in his country. For this reason, I feel he needed to be removed, and it probably should have been done a long time ago. We are seeing many other pieces of evidence of his disregard with his current trial where last week he admitted to killing 168 people who sought to overthrow him after the Gulf War. Also, when you read the United Nations investigation into the now defunct Oil-For-Food Program that he was supposed to trade his oil for other country's food for his people. That food never got the Iraqi people but sat under military control in storage facilities while Saddam got kickbacks to build his presidential palaces (it's all in the PDF file on Foxnews.com...don't know if it's still available).

I do feel most American hate and detest terrorism. I also think that if people want change, they need to realize they have it with voting. If people feel that Bush went to invade Iraq for oil, or because his dad said so, or for whatever reason, people had the chance. If Kerry had won, we may be in a different position. However, Bush won, and here we are. Timothy McViegh tried through violence to make change with the government. The government, however, didn't change and all he did was give pain to people he had never met.

Contrapasso said:

I also think that if people want change, they need to realize they have it with voting. If people feel that Bush went to invade Iraq for oil, or because his dad said so, or for whatever reason, people had the chance. If Kerry had won, we may be in a different position. However, Bush won, and here we are.

Pilch said:

Are we talking about voting and voter apathy now? Or george bush, we have so completely gone off at a major tangent. do you think we ought to get back on track? Or do you think this is just the way this conversation has progressed?

Contrapasso said:

I have a question for those of you supporting the terrorist in V for Vendetta (a movie I have not yet seen, which I will concede). In looking at your opinions from a logical standpoint, if you support this terrorist in this movie, as the poster "Catboy" does, does this mean that you will support Al Qeada in Oliver Stone's movie about the 9/11 attacks? It's all very easy to support a "comic book" terrorist; but, when you look at real life, which the attacks of 9/11 are, how can you say that this terrorist in V, or any other terrorist, is someone to glorify...unless you support the acts of killing innocents and destroying property? As far as the poster "Damageinc346" concerned, if for some reason you don't like the United States goverment, and the lifestyle you have, go live somewhere repressive like Syria in the Middle East or the Sudan in Africa. When your there do a quick comparison and let us know.