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BY DAVID SERVER |
As many of you know, I not too long ago returned from a jaunt to
the Prague
set
of Guillermo del Toro's upcoming adaptation of the cult Dark Horse comic, 'Hellboy'.
I set out to Prague with questions for the cast, and upon my arrival was informed
that only Ron 'Hellboy' Perlman would be filming that week, as they
were shooting a fight scene between Hellboy and a particularly nasty looking
demon. Sadly, I had *just* missed Doug Jones, who will be playing the amphibious
BPRD Agent Abe Sapien, by one day! While I had a total blast with Perlman, del
Toro, and the crew, you guys had questions for the man behind the fish, and gosh-darnit,
I wasn't about to let the Hell-fans down! So, after some wheeling and dealing
with the fine folks over at Sony, I set up a phone interview with the one and
only Doug Jones to talk about his recently wrapped work as 'psychic merman' Abe
Sapien!
CD: For all the 'Hellboy' newcomers out there, could
you give us a little background on who Abe Sapien is exactly, like
his personality, his history, and his powers?
Doug Jones: Well it's funny, because as far as where he comes
from, I still don't have any idea really!
CD: Yeah, it's a little vague in the comics, too...
DJ: Even talking with [series creator] Mike Mignola, I had breakfast
with him one day at the hotel, when my job was first starting. And I
thought, 'Oh great, I have this chance to talk to the creator of
Hellboy and find some information out', right? And he put his hand
up and he said, 'I gotta tell ya, right up front, I have *no* idea
where Abe comes from'! [laughs] So I thought, 'Oh...ok...' But
Mike is a fantastic guy and I love him to death. So basically, for those
who don't know, Abe Sapien is a fish-guy who was found in a tank 'somewhere', 'one
day' [laughs], and he was sort of taken in by Professor Bruttenholm,
as was Hellboy. Hellboy and I kind of grew up as brothers, that's
sort of the feeling I got, even though Hellboy and Professor Bruttenholm
are more like father and son...I kinda feel like a cousin in a way.
And Abe has this sort of clairvoyant or psychic ability to put up his
palm and 'read' what you're thinking and where you've
been, or he can put up his palm on an inanimate object and tell who's
been with it, what has happened in this room before, all that kind of
stuff. When Hellboy needs to get something done, Abe is the brain he
turns to.
CD: So you mentioned that you've talked with Mike a bit
- have you read any Hellboy comics since you started filming?
DJ: Oh, y'know what? They're sittin' there! And I
swear I'm gonna get to 'em! [laughs] I got a smattering of 'em
before I left, and then of course while I was in Prague it was all about
the script and the movie at hand, and since I've been home, I sort
of hit the ground running, I've already had three jobs since I've
been back in the last month, so it's kinda been 'Bloo-Blau-Blee-Blah!!' [Ed.
Note: Yes, Doug really said this; it was awesome] So it's been
kinda quick and crazy.
CD: Was anything more difficult than you had anticipated? Maybe
the makeup would be a good example of that...
DJ: Well I've done a lot of high makeup type jobs before, so I
did know that there was some pain and discomfort going in. But there
were no shocks or surprises, I knew what I was getting into.
CD: Could you see at all under all of Abe's facial prosthetics?
DJ: Yes, it was kind of like looking through toilet paper roles, so
I didn't have any peripheral vision. If you look at the face, those
eyes are pretty big, and those eyes were popped into the eye sockets
of the mask that was glued on me. I was looking down through where the
tear ducts would be, in the corners. So my eyes are closer set together
than Abe's are...I hope [laughs].
CD: So what did you think of the makeup the first time you really
had it on for shooting in Prague, when it was no longer for test shots
or anything but the finished stuff?
DJ: Oh, I was...I was extremely happy. When we did the makeup tests
back here in Los Angeles a couple months before, I was astounded with
that look. And since those tests, they even broadened the shoulders and
made the chest a bit more...chesty. So when it went on for the first
time in Prague before we shot, I was like..."Oh my...I
am one sexy fish!" And I never thought I would hear those words
come out of my mouth! [laughs] It's funny, but I look at Abe and
I think Abe would make the perfect date! They gave me this sexy body,
and the face is really beautiful even though it's freaky and fishy,
but it's beautiful! And add to that that he can put up his palm
and know everything about you...[laughs] We did a photo shoot, and
so a bunch of marketing people and PR people and whatnot came from Sony
and Revolution Studios for a photo shoot day. The women on that crew,
these are people who had already seen some dailies and some rough-cut
scenes, and watching the way they reacted to me was eyebrow raising for
me. I was like, 'Wait, wha...?' I mean, there was some
hair-tossing goin' on, you know what I mean? [laughs] I mean, if
they knew I was just a skinny geek under here, they'd be so ashamed
of themselves! [laughs] No, they wouldn't be really...I'm
not that ugly!
CD: Hahaha, of course not! So the last time we talked, you had
yet to shoot anything at all for the film. Now you're all wrapped.
How did production go from your standpoint?
DJ: Y'know, this was the most exciting and fun job I think I've
ever done. And at the same time it was the hardest I've ever done.
The thing is I've had long makeup jobs before, where I'm
in the makeup process for a long time, but this was anywhere between
five and seven hours. It was five hours if I was wearing the [wetsuit]
on my costume that day, and without it, they had to do up my whole torso
as well to be 'fish-guy', and that was an extra two hours.
So when you've already put in a seven hour day and then your twelve
hour shooting day starts, that makes for a long reeeally really tiring
thing. So I had to push through a lot of pain and discomfort to get to
the character of Abe. But once I got there and the cameras were rolling,
it was so worth it. Because I honestly and absolutely love this character.
I love playing him, I love his relationships with everyone else in the
film. I love him.
CD: What is it that you gravitated towards in Abe's character?
DJ: I'm the youngest of four boys, and all three of my older brothers
have masters' degrees, and one's a PhD...they're
all really smart. And I was just happy to, like, pass in college, right?
And here Abe is, this *incredibly* intelligent being, who reads four
books at a time, and knows everything...And he's the character
everybody comes to for answers. And he's not stuck on himself or
full of himself over this, he's very humble about it, just very
matter-of-fact and very very caring and nurturing as a person...[takes
a moment to reconsider his wording]...as a being. So that's
what I love about him. I mean, Abe is somebody that *I* would like to
know!
CD: Getting back to the rigors of the shoot, what would you
say was your toughest day of shooting?
DJ: Toughest day of shooting...I remember it well. That would be
my birthday!
CD: Really?
DJ: Yeah, it was May 24th...
CD: Well happy extremely late birthday!
DJ: Oh, well thank you! It was a twenty hour shoot day, and it was the
day that my character is in a medical healing tank, and in order to shoot
that, instead of dipping me in water they actually suspended me in wires
from a hip harness to shoot dry for wet, they'd add in the water
effect later..
CD: Did they always do that or were you ever actually in water?
DJ: I was in water either going into it or coming out of it, but when
you see underwater scenes, that was...well...wink wink [laughs]
CD: Heh, gotcha.
DJ: But anywho, in the medical tank, I was hanging right side up in
one scene, kind of unconscious but 'on-the-mend', and this
hip harness had to be so so tight in order to suspend me, and I'm
a skinny guy, so I have these hip bones that are pressure points in the
front that were just...starting to kill me! Then, I didn't
realize we were shooting another scene that day in the medical tank when
I'm awake and better now, and floating upside-down playing with
a Rubik's cube, and so hanging upside down there's even more
pressure on those hipbones, and I didn't hear until hour sixteen
of that day that we were going to be doing that scene as well that day...oh,
turning upside down and going take after take on that was excruciating...
CD: Happy birthday, right?
DJ: Well, what was really nice, though, after that, Guillermo had heard
through the grape-vine and it had got around the set so everybody knew
it was my birthday by the end of the day, Guillermo took me out to dinner
along with the rest of the cast the next night to say happy birthday...Guillermo
is a genuinely good person, I really really like him.
CD: We're gonna come back to him later, so hold onto those
thoughts. So the character in the comic books, and this is reflected
in the makeup, doesn't tend to be very expressive, especially
facially -- with the big bug-eyes and no real eyebrows to speak
of. Does this make your job as an actor a lot harder?
DJ: Oh right...And I have visited the Hellboy movie message board
and I've seen that comment come up quite a bit...My own facial
expression wasn't able to come through the top half of the face.
So that was a bit of a challenge for me. So with the physicality that
I ended up giving the role, I had to add more, with my head gesturing,
and whatever I could do with my mouth without being cartoony. I tried
to do what I could, but the eyes are going to be computer graphics [augmented],
they're gonna blink and look around some. The eyes will read more
than what you see in the pictures.
CD: In your movement, did you try to move or act like a fish...?
DJ: Can I tell you where I get my character study? I have four goldfish
in a tank, and I watched 'em. I just watched 'em! And seeing
how their heads would dart, same with their eyes...but then the rest
of their body flows fluidly behind that jerky head. So that's kind
of how I handled Abe. His head was more poppy jerk movements, but then
the rest of him flowed fluidly behind.
CD: Heh, that's pretty cool. So what did you think of
the finished footage as it was coming along as shooting progressed?
DJ: Oh my gosh, yeah, every now and again, Guillermo would pop a tape
in at the monitors, and I would look at a scene we'd shot a couple
days before, or if they'd already edited a rough cut together,
and that's when I got excited. 'Oh my gosh...we're
gonna make a real movie here! This is looking beautiful already...' And
that's without any post-production effects, and it was just *excellent*!
CD: I'm going to list some of the people you worked with
on this film, and I want you to say a few things about your impressions
of them, starting with Ron Perlman.
DJ: Love, love, love! He fell into his role so easily, and I mean he's
a fantastic actor, and I've seen his work over the years, such
an array of A to Z, he can do it all, and convincingly. Hellboy seems
to be such a fun fit for him, he gets to play this big brute who is all
about muscle, and what I loved about that is that our characters complemented
each other so well. I was sort of like the heart and brains, and he was
like the brawn. And he couldn't do his job without me, so I felt
useful! But off camera too, we kind of fell into those roles as well.
Because he...[laughs] well, Ron lives large, is what I can say...
CD: Well Ron *is* large, so that's appropriate!
DJ: Haha, yeah. But I tend to be a tad more conservative. So we kind
of carried our relationship off camera as well.
CD: Ok; Selma Blair.
DJ: Sel-ma! I love Selma! She is such a sweet woman! And she is so kind,
and, oh my word -- she is so funny, too! She's funnier than
I had expected even! She's got a great wit on her, and is a truly
caring person. You know it's funny, one day (I think it was the
day after I met her) I saw her, and she had some fan mail that she was
responding to, and she was taking self addressed stamped envelopes to
the production offices to make sure they got back in the mail. And watching
her do this was just like, 'well that's class.' I like
seeing someone of her stature taking the time for her fans.
CD: Ok, John Hurt.
DJ: Oh! Ok, now John Hurt...aha, I was so fricking *honored* to
be in his presence...talk about stature, right? A decorated British
actor of such renown and everything, and I had seen him over the years
in so many different things. And I had no idea how he was going to be,
to meet him in person, and when I did, he was so generous and kind and
gracious. Y'know, he's a cheek kisser! He's very European!
He wouldn't say hello or goodbye without doing that with me!
CD: Heh, I didn't know people actually did that!
DJ: Oh it was just great! And the first comment he had to me, he had
never seen me until that first day that we were in the scene together,
and he had no idea what I looked like as a person, so there I am as Abe.
So I'm standing in front of him, introducing myself, and he's
shaking my hand and he looks me up and down and he says [Doug switches
on a British accent] "Is this everything you'd dreamed of?" And
I said, "Yeees!" [laughs] But y'know, he understood,
and this is something going back to Ron and John Hurt, both of them understand
what its like to be under lots of prosthetic makeup, they both have a
history of doing those kinds of jobs as well. So I felt like I was definitely
not alone.
CD: Good deal. So then, of course, last but not least -- Guillermo
del Toro.
DJ: Guillermo. Guillermo is...he's a nine year old boy in
an adult's body. I just love that man, and the thing is that he
could give me such specific direction and I trusted every syllable that
came out of his mouth. Not once did I question him, or did anything not
feel right. His instincts are just spot on, and his love for Hellboy,
his love for this project, his love for the comic books, his love for
this whole genre even, is why I think he's gonna make a kick-ass
movie! Because he's gonna make a movie that he wants to watch,
and he is the ultimate ultimate fan. And he's so good humored,
too. I mean, on the set, even if we were having a rough day, his voice
stays loud and fun. And he throws cuss-words around in the way that it's
*so* non-offensive...we had the best time.
CD: You had a lot of neat prosthetics to wear and props to work
with in this film...did you have a favorite?
DJ: Hmm...well, I think it would have to do with Abe's breathing,
whether it was his actual gills, because those are just so pretty, the
way they moved...I thought those were just beautiful. And they were
so fricking real! So either those, or if I was wearing the breathing
apparatus over those [Ed. Note: Abe wears a 'water-collar' over
his gills when out of the water for a long time so he can 'breathe']
with the water that was pumping through it and the air bubbles that were
bubbling through it. I mean, they were very comfortable to wear, the
boys as Spectral Motion [special effects] took excellent care of me,
they're just fantastic. Whenever I would wear that, people would
stop and talk to me and just stare at the bubbles going around my collar
[laughs]. So that was an interesting and fun thing.
CD: There's still a possibility that they will go with
a different voice actor to provide the voice of Abe in the film -- how
do you feel about that?
DJ: Well, oh gosh...I would be lying to you if I told you I would
be ok with someone else doing the voice by now, because I just spent
three months of my life, and my heart and soul, on this character. So
I would love more than anything to see my voice stay with him. So yeah,
I know I'm still as much in the running as anyone else Guillermo
would like...
CD: Oh yeah, he made it clear when I talked to him in Prague
that he thought you did a great job and that you deserved a real shot
at the voice and he has so much respect for all the work you did...
DJ: Oh, well that's very sweet to hear. And he never gave me direction
voice-wise that I wasn't hitting it right on-set. So I did all
the dialogue on set, and I felt really good about it. So I'm hoping
that we can get to do some ADR work without the teeth in my mouth and
without my nose plugged, cause that would be even better!
CD: What are your hopes and expectations for this project in
its finished form?
DJ: Well one thing, and honestly I don't want to sound too cheesy,
but I am such a lover of the fans because honestly without all you guys,
we would not have jobs. And I stand by that, and so my number one concern
about this entire project is that the true-blue fans of Hellboy be satisfied,
that they love it and can't wait for a second one. That's
what I hope.
CD: Speaking of the fans, who are actually the source of a few
of these questions, what have you thought about people from the production
(yourself included) interacting with the fans directly through the
official website? That possibility is sort of a new thing for Hollywood,
thanks to technology...
DJ: Yeah, it is. And I have never, in all my seventeen years of acting
so far, I've never been on a project that had this much hype ahead
of time. So this has been a completely new experience for me -- I've
already gotten fan mail at my agent's office who want signed pictures
already, and they've seen nothing yet! So that is *completely*
new for me, and it's very humbling because I'm just hoping
that when this movie comes out, I hope and hope and pray that I do Abe
to everyone's satisfaction, that really is a concern of mine.
CD: What are your hopes about how this role, easily one of your
biggest parts, will affect your career?
DJ: Yeah, well selfishly speaking, I hope that this does shine a spotlight
on Doug Jones for a second, that would be fabulous, that would be a nice
little side effect of it all, and I do hope that this movie does well
enough that a sequel is demanded, even -- that everyone MUST HAVE
A SEQUEL! [laughs]
CD: That was pretty cool that you were in that shot in TIME
Magazine...
DJ: Oh my god! Yeees! Y'know honestly, since I didn't know
a whole lot about Hellboy before I took this job, I didn't realize
that Abe might be alongside Hellboy and Liz, y'know, on a poster!
I just had no idea!
CD: Yeah, you're on one of the posters they gave away
at the San Diego Comicon.
DJ: Yeah, so I was dumbfounded when I saw that picture, I was just very 'Oh...dear...me.' It's
very humbling, and I don't think I've done anything to deserve
it all, but it's very sweet when it happens. And I could not believe
it, to see that stuff come out a year before the movie! So it will be
interesting to see, as it gets closer, what the press will do.
CD: So you've mentioned the possibility of a sequel a
bunch of times, I guess that means that you would be up for reprising
the role for a sequel?
DJ: I would be very interested in reprising the role for a sequel! It
has not been talked about 'contractually', and so I'm
pretty open to discussion when the time comes, yes.
CD: Speaking about the future, you mentioned that you just finished
three jobs since you've been back -- care to expand?
DJ: Oh well yeah, they're all small. One was a commercial for
an Advair Asthma Inhaler, one was a test shoot for Panavision, a new
technology for a new lens they have, and that was shown at a show biz
expo here in LA recently. And the other thing was, I did a little comedy
sketch for 'The Man Show' on Comedy Central...
CD: Ha, no kidding! Did it air already?
DJ: No, and I'm not really quite sure when it is going to air,
I'm not really sure I quite want to tell anybody else about...[laughs]
CD: Hahaha, then are you sure you want to mention it here?
DJ: Aw, you can mention it, sure...
CD: What exactly did you do in the skit? Or do you want to keep
that a secret?
DJ: Um, well let's see, it was...it was a pre-taped little
thing where they made it look like a home video where I'm auditioning,
I'm sending a tape in by myself, that's the look, telling
the camera why I think I would make a really good porn star...[laughs]
But it's 'The Man Show', so... It's in there.
CD: Heh, good stuff. So do you have anything else coming up?
DJ: Um, I think you might have asked that the last time we talked and
I think I might have told you about Flora Plum [directed by Jodie Foster]...
CD: I did and you did.
DJ: Ha, that's right. And that looks like it's postponed
until March of 2004, so that's next year. So that's the one
thing I know of that's one the horizon, sort of.
CD: Cool. So wrapping up, in your opinion, what sets Hellboy
apart from some of the other comic book movies that are getting made
these days, like Spider-Man?
DJ: Hmm...Well, I'll tell you what set it apart for me, was
before I said yes to taking the role, what Guillermo had to say about
it. And that is that the character of Hellboy himself is a demon who
is now fighting the forces of hell. To me, and this is something Guillermo
and I discussed on the phone the day before I said yes to the project,
and that was that. And because y'know I'm a Christian as
well, and looking at a script with a demon as the hero is like, 'Oooh
dear...' [laughs], but after reading the script it was like, 'Oh
my gosh, I *love* this character!' Because all of us have a past.
We all have something that we've come from that we have to overcome,
if we're gonna succeed in life. And Hellboy has the ultimate thing
to overcome; I mean he's Satan's spawn! It doesn't
get much worse than that! But, Hellboy is kind of like an example of
someone who can 'file down the horns', brush off your shoes,
and go on to live a life that has some meaning and some good to it, no
matter where you come from. So that is what sets it apart for me and
that's why I'm really really excited to be a part of it.
CD: And finally, do you have any final message for the fans
eagerly counting down the days until April 2nd, 2004?
DJ: Heh heh, well, keep the internet a-buzzin'! It's so
much fun to watch that tornado get whipped up. And I will visit the Hellsite.com
message boards soon, so I'd love to say hi again. And please, anybody
who wants, please say hi to me too!
CD: Great! Thanks so much, Doug!
DJ: Thanks for your excitement!
That's surely not the last we'll hear from Doug! Stop
by the Hellsite message boards to give your best to Doug and Guillermo
del Toro, and keep it here at CountingDown for all the latest Hellboy
updates. Hey, come to think of it, weren't there a few more HB
cast members that you guys had questions for? Hmm...we'll
have to see what we can do about that!
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